tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post5409278118354103963..comments2024-03-14T17:59:30.786-04:00Comments on [Birth Mother] First Mother Forum: Loving an Adopted Child As Much as 'One of Your Own'Lorraine Duskyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/18285341379272250245noreply@blogger.comBlogger30125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-55215860090885548292009-09-10T09:50:20.876-04:002009-09-10T09:50:20.876-04:00I agree, they are different things, and I'm su...I agree, they are different things, and I'm sure it's painful to have to observe others benefiting from the the genetic bond, knowing that you've been denied it. <br />But it is love that's being discussed here, not bonding.<br /><br /><br />Of course, some people consider adoption as bondage.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-81943153656449811172009-09-07T11:58:30.391-04:002009-09-07T11:58:30.391-04:00It bothers me that I constantly see the phrase, &q...It bothers me that I constantly see the phrase, "...but I see that in non-adoptive families, too." These conversations do not have to do with non-adoptive families. Adoptive families do have issues that can happen in non-adoptive families, but when you add in the adoption factor, the situation is entirely different. <br /> <br />My ap's adopted me, then adopted my brother, then had our sister. There is no doubt the love they had was the same, but the BOND was entirely different. It is IMPOSSIBLE for an adoptive mother to be bonded to her adoptive child in the same way she is adopted to her biological child. She did not give birth to her adoptee, and is only related by law to her adoptee. <br />The bond our adoptive mother had with our sister was undeniable. It hurt us to see that bond. It made being adopted even more painful, because we could see, on a daily basis,how strong that natural bond is, and that we were missing out. <br /> <br />Often times, I feel people confuse the word "love" with "bond".lindalouwhonoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-17009682350049953882009-09-06T13:00:48.439-04:002009-09-06T13:00:48.439-04:00Yeah, Mara, that was the best part of the movie.
...Yeah, Mara, that was the best part of the movie. <br /><br />It was just another psycho-thriller like psycho babysitter, psycho secretary etc. I wonder if landlords around the US started a protest to scream unfair portrayal of landords after Micheal Keaton's role as a psycho landlord?Michellehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13757981963159861606noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-71937228001712289672009-09-06T11:57:51.069-04:002009-09-06T11:57:51.069-04:00Michelle-
Ya, the end of the movie was so creepy ...Michelle-<br /><br />Ya, the end of the movie was so creepy when she pulled out her fake "nice" teeth and her nasty, yellow/brown ones were revealed. This was after she wiped off all her makeup showing her age spots!!!<br /><br />I made a silly petition to make fun of the people who were protesting this movie. Here's the link:<br />http://www.thepetitionsite.com/1/orphan-movie-t-shirts-for-open-records<br /><br />-MaraAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-15213395111531555392009-09-05T22:16:33.398-04:002009-09-05T22:16:33.398-04:00well said Triona, "Regarding the other commen...well said Triona, "Regarding the other comments, I don't think it's possible to generalize about these things, only discuss our experiences and observations and hopefully gain some understanding from it."Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-51475456585204589382009-09-05T20:40:33.298-04:002009-09-05T20:40:33.298-04:00Has anybody seen the movie Orphan? Esther isn'...Has anybody seen the movie Orphan? Esther isn't an adoptee - she a 33-yr-old psychiatric institution escapee from Russia who likes other women's sexy husbands. <br /><br />The line that caused all those adopters to go ballistic was rather uneventful, really, but it did fit well with her scheme to try and drive the a-mother insane.Michellehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13757981963159861606noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-11386464079215011182009-09-05T12:21:20.641-04:002009-09-05T12:21:20.641-04:00osolomama wrote: "In my original post, I wond...osolomama wrote: "In my original post, I wondered if searching and reunion could tilt the balance of power with the a-parents so much that they might withdraw from the child and find ways to punish her for a relationship with her first family."<br /><br />That was the case with me. I was not ever supposed to ask those questions, and my doing so was part of the reason I was disowned. My adoptive father's biological children from his first marriage, however, could do no wrong, while it seemed like I could do no right.<br /><br />Jane wrote: "The adopted children were simply different and demanded more from the parents. Perversely, they made themselves "unloveable". They also had adoption issues which the adoptive parents seemed unaware of. The parents went the extra mile for these children but clearly had periods of anger and frustration."<br /><br />Jane, I wonder if some adoptees do this in order to "reject before being rejected", to test the waters and see if they really are loveable no matter how bad they are. I have known some adoptees who did this with their adoptive families and/or with their birth families upon reunion. I find myself doing it on occasion, mostly with my spouse and mostly subconscious, as if I'm trying to see if he'll still love me if I'm bad. It REALLY annoys me when I catch myself at it. I'm sure it bugs him too. ;)<br /><br />Regarding the other comments, I don't think it's possible to generalize about these things, only discuss our experiences and observations and hopefully gain some understanding from it.Triona Guidryhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00969598333210972017noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-59337236335026731982009-09-05T10:45:33.420-04:002009-09-05T10:45:33.420-04:00My point is that it's actually very difficult ...My point is that it's actually very difficult to come up with one truth that mirrors everyone's situation. I know one family in which the children have become virtually indistinguishable. I have to remind myself which one is adopted. I don't know the reason for that except that there is a profound sense on the part of the mother that the type of favouritism you are talking about is abhorrent (the family is now headed just by the mom). But this doesn't really prove anything either. This just illustrates my insight based on knowing this person.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-2403892030580384872009-09-05T08:06:27.773-04:002009-09-05T08:06:27.773-04:00Osolo, I'm with you on this one, only an adopt...Osolo, I'm with you on this one, only an adoptive parent can answer as to how much they love their adopted child. I can't see into your mind and heart so I really don't know. But I do know some very good adoptive moms. I don't think adoptive mothers should make blanket statements about the quality of surrendering mothers' love, nor should we make that assumption about adoptive mothers in general.<br /><br />Kippa, I also agree with you, that some people who feel all adoption is wrong and inferior to biological parenting have already made up their minds that adoptive parents' love for their children is inferior as well. They are not really asking a question but making a statement.<br /><br />Angelle, I DO know adoptive parents who have encouraged and helped their adult kids to search, and have not guilted them about it.I did not make that up. These are real people, including adoptive parents who have stood by and loved a son who is gay, HIV positive, and schizophrenic for over 40 years. <br /><br />Adoptive families, like biological families, are all different. I have seen all kinds, good and bad. The family my son got was not a good one, but I do not see my story as a template for all adoption. Nor do I believe that biology is the sole determinant of human love or connection. It plays a part, yes, but humans are not solely driven by biology.maryannenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-67900582869657463232009-09-05T06:45:53.867-04:002009-09-05T06:45:53.867-04:00Jane,
As a parent with a surrendered (reunited) ...Jane, <br /><br />As a parent with a surrendered (reunited) biological son, a kept biological son and an adopted son, all of whom are adult, I feel I am in as good as any and probably better position than most to comment.<br /> <br />I know that I love all my children equally, and, as far as possibly (given that they are different people with different personalities and needs) strive to treat them with equal care and consideration.<br /><br />I know a number of families that have adopted, some that already had bio children at the time of the adoption, others where children were born later - and, although I have observed with interest, I have not been able to make any such clear cut observations.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-23053296968362804832009-09-05T01:22:42.108-04:002009-09-05T01:22:42.108-04:00Osolomama,
My comment was based on what I have ob...Osolomama,<br /><br />My comment was based on what I have observed when I have been around people who have both biological and adoptive children. <br /><br />I think it may be quite different for adoptive parents who do not have bio-children.Jane Edwardshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05669797756463841249noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-71630602318034893552009-09-04T23:09:03.732-04:002009-09-04T23:09:03.732-04:00"Parents who have both bio and adopted childr..."Parents who have both bio and adopted children may subconsciously want the bio kids to do better. After all, these kids are theirs and the adopted kids are the offspring of low-lifers. If the adopted children are more successful, what does it say about the adoptive parents?"<br /><br />Jane, since you've never actually adopted, why would you attempt to describe the mindset of adoptive parents? What do you really know about what it feels like to be one or how one feels about one's child? It's amazing to me at times that FMF wanders into this territory with zero experience in the particulars (watching the a-family from the sidelines doesn't count). I would certainly never speculate on your experiences in this fashion.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-44444257511483549612009-09-04T22:00:51.638-04:002009-09-04T22:00:51.638-04:00I find that my daughter is treated different from ...I find that my daughter is treated different from the illigentament (sp) of her adoptive father. In fact, I know about it and my daughter does not. When the other daughter came into the picture, my daughter was totally pushed out of the picture. <br /><br />I don't know why, but I have watched people and wonder the same question, if you really love them, why go all the way to China or whatever to adopt out of fear that they may love some one else? Is it not just as good to have a child that will have your love, will love you, and another parent who will extend that love into a healthy, happy and successful adult?<br /><br />Maybe I am as dumb as I think.Lorihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05815710859859029536noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-62814764366135607762009-09-04T21:32:21.319-04:002009-09-04T21:32:21.319-04:00I think that ingrained in all of us is the desire ...I think that ingrained in all of us is the desire to be proud of those who carry our genes. It's a compliment when a man says about his son who has done well in some endeavor, "that's my boy!" <br /><br />Parents who have both bio and adopted children may subconsciously want the bio kids to do better. After all, these kids are theirs and the adopted kids are the offspring of low-lifers. If the adopted children are more successful, what does it say about the adoptive parents?<br /><br />I agree with Mary Anne that one can't generalize from one situation and that the thing we call "love" is any number of things. <br /><br />In the five families I have known who had both adopted and bio children, however, I did see substantial differences in the relationship of the adoptive parents to the adopted child and to the bio child. The adopted children were simply different and demanded more from the parents. Perversely, they made themselves "unloveable". They also had adoption issues which the adoptive parents seemed unaware of. The parents went the extra mile for these children but clearly had periods of anger and frustration.<br /><br />The bio children seemed to know they were the favorite and worked doubly hard to please their parents. In three of the five families, the adopted child distanced herself from the adoptive family when she grew up.<br /><br />Having raised three bio-daughters and, of course, knowing many families with several bio children, I know that there are differences among bio siblings as well. The children most like their parents have an easier time.<br /><br />The bio/adopted conflict may extend to grandparents as well. I know a fine couple with two daughters, one daughter adopted two children and the other had two bio children. Although the grandparents tried to be fair, their preference for the bio grandchildren was obvious.Jane Edwardshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05669797756463841249noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-61380906332130865222009-09-04T19:51:07.573-04:002009-09-04T19:51:07.573-04:00I think the more appropriate question is whether t...I think the more appropriate question is whether the adoptee will love the adoptive parent as if they were his/her own.<br />That's the part that no one seems to get.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-35537698143984508862009-09-04T18:36:21.027-04:002009-09-04T18:36:21.027-04:00Following on what Maryanne says "I do know so...Following on what Maryanne says "I do know some adoptive parents, like the ones who post here, who love their adopted kids as much as any parent loves any kid."<br /><br />Really? I guess some have the best intentions but I wonder still. Even if it was a closed adoption, or internaitonal adoption and the birth mother somehow is now in the child's life? <br /><br />I am not talking about 6 year old's here, I am talking about adult adoptees who may WANT a relationship with their natural mothers and are "guilted" for that desire. <br /><br />It is easy to be magnanimous if you are not face to face with the reality.Angellehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02400662014485775139noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-11391584504644163852009-09-04T18:24:20.623-04:002009-09-04T18:24:20.623-04:00Kippa: Do you have an e-mail address? I want to ta...Kippa: Do you have an e-mail address? I want to talk to you about something specific and due to that "something", it's not for the public to witness. It'd be really appreciated.<br /><br />If you don't want to give it out, here's mine:<br /><br />little.wing04@hotmail.com<br /><br />I really really want to talk to you about something on a previous post.Mei-Linghttp://exiledsister.wordpress.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-7737007722610162492009-09-04T16:02:58.452-04:002009-09-04T16:02:58.452-04:00"That is why people still ask: "Can you ..."That is why people still ask: "Can you REALLY love your adopted child as much as if s/he were born to you biologically?"<br /><br />The thing is, Mei-Ling, do they REALLY want to know the answer?<br />When the kind of people who repeatedly ask that kind of question are answered in the affirmative by people who REALLY do know from personal experience that indeed, yes indeed, it IS possible, they don't believe it anyway. <br />They just go on asking.<br /><br />Which leads me to believe that the motive behind the question is not what all it's pretended to be.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-63880634843970269912009-09-04T13:50:22.393-04:002009-09-04T13:50:22.393-04:00My a-brother stole my inheritance and believes to ...My a-brother stole my inheritance and believes to this day that it is rightfully his because I was not a biological child.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-75332397015468466072009-09-04T12:16:50.796-04:002009-09-04T12:16:50.796-04:00"Does it really, if the only children in the ..."Does it really, if the only children in the family are adoptive children?"<br /><br />Osolomama, yes. Well, not "different" in a bad way, but in an attempt to explain:<br /><br />When somebody asks (generic) you about children, they don't mean adopting. They mean biologically-related children. It doesn't matter if you are able to conceive or not; the point is that it is implied that you *should* be having biologically-related children, because that is the "norm" of society.<br /><br />That is why people still ask: "Can you REALLY love your adopted child as much as if s/he were born to you biologically?"<br /><br />It isn't a given.<br /><br />That doesn't make it "bad" or "lesser then." It means it's different and not assumed by default.Mei-Linghttp://exiledsister.wordpress.com/noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-7737239410880316022009-09-04T08:21:11.932-04:002009-09-04T08:21:11.932-04:00It is meaningless to ask if an adoptive parent can...It is meaningless to ask if an adoptive parent can love an adopted child as much as one of their own, if this is asked as a generalization encompassing all adoptive families.<br /><br />How does one quantify "love"? How does someone else know what is any other person's heart?<br /><br />It is certainly possible to look at the family dynamics of one family, as Lorraine has done with Jane's adoptive family, and conclude that one child was treated worse than the others and perhaps loved less. I think you are on shaky ground, though, trying to generalize this to all adoptive families.<br /><br />We all have a tendency to do this, me too. It is very tempting to see your own situation as a universal norm. However, I do not think anecdotal evidence really works when you are dealing with something as complex and subjective as love in a family.<br /><br />I do not believe that a biological connection automatically equals love. I know many mothers disagree with that. There are too many biological parents who have different levels of connection and affection for their biological children, and some that have none. Sibling rivalry is a reality in families of all sorts, and so many factors play into feeling closer or less close to any child.<br /><br />Yes, some adoptees are treated badly and unfairly by their adoptive parents, some are abused, some are disowned. Perhaps this happens with more frequency in adoptive families, but I really do not know that. I think sometimes adoption makes love harder if child and parents are very dissimilar, especially if the child has other problems including behavior, but this can happen in biological families as well.<br /><br />I do know some adoptive parents, like the ones who post here, who love their adopted kids as much as any parent loves any kid. In some families with adopted and bio kids, it is the adoptee who is favored, in some they are treated all alike, in others the adoptee is not treated well, usually due to a lot of factors beyond just being adopted. <br /><br />This is just not a simple, yes or no answer subject.maryannenoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-16719868167442562752009-09-04T07:10:13.951-04:002009-09-04T07:10:13.951-04:00I guess I really am strange. I do not care one way...I guess I really am strange. I do not care one way or another about my daughters other parents. They have no relationship with her and what was there, as far as I can tell, was never love. <br /><br />But for me, the only answer I could ever give my daughter is "I do, have and will always love you." This is the only answer I would give any of the strays I took care of through the years. Some of them related to me, some not. Made no difference. To this day anyone one of my lost ones could knock on the door and say "Mom, can I stay for a while." and the answer would always be the same. "Of course, I love you now a little bit more than yesterday." and out pops the hide-a-bed or whatever extra bed I have.<br /><br />Love is not something you can give and take away. It can only be given if it is real. For only the love that is shared means anything at all.Lorihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05815710859859029536noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-73164447334980578802009-09-04T00:12:10.375-04:002009-09-04T00:12:10.375-04:00"And therein lies the unspoken difference in ..."And therein lies the unspoken difference in adoption - that the reassurance is NOT a given in adoption, that that line HAS to be said to begin with." <br /><br />Does it really, if the only children in the family are adoptive children? I'm trying to remember what my daughter has said around this and the interest seems more related to why I didn't get married. How a bio-kid would compete for my attention doesn't enter into the equation.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-82552736380520859502009-09-03T23:43:49.783-04:002009-09-03T23:43:49.783-04:00Osolomama you said: "In my original post, I w...Osolomama you said: "In my original post, I wondered if searching and reunion could tilt the balance of power with the a-parents so much that they might withdraw from the child and find ways to punish her for a relationship with her first family."<br /><br />My son and I are living in just the nightmare you describe in this statement. Knowing the outcome of Lorraine's fragile child who was adopted, it is frightening to think what lengths some aparents may imagine are OK to go to in order to maintain their superiority.Angellehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02400662014485775139noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-58192140956817728152009-09-03T22:03:49.213-04:002009-09-03T22:03:49.213-04:00Not having any biological children, I can't an...Not having any biological children, I can't answer the question by comparison. All I know is that I love my children.<br /><br />The other question, of course, is whether adopted children can love adoptive parents in the same way that non-adopted children love the biological parents who raise them. I blogged about that a few months ago:<br /><br />http://chinaadoptiontalk.blogspot.com/2008/12/nature-and-quality-of-love-in-adoptive.htmlmalindahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06233439015219192874noreply@blogger.com