tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post260141683623269429..comments2024-03-27T20:48:39.389-04:00Comments on [Birth Mother] First Mother Forum: Supreme Court rules against Indian father, limits Indian Child Welfare ActLorraine Duskyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/18285341379272250245noreply@blogger.comBlogger24125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-4089438099961273682013-07-05T22:06:18.969-04:002013-07-05T22:06:18.969-04:00I've been consumed by personal family issues o...I've been consumed by personal family issues of late and am only just learning that this case went all the way to the US Supreme Court. What a nightmare! I cannot believe the child is at risk of being removed from her father now--this is all so crazy. Jenniferhttp://www.abortedadoption.blogspot.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-29218387228596400592013-07-03T18:24:40.514-04:002013-07-03T18:24:40.514-04:00I knew that no-longer-little Josie 'n Jack Rob...I knew that no-longer-little Josie 'n Jack Roberts were adopted, but that backstory is atrocious. What will Mums and Chief Justice Adopter say when the wee bairns ask why they were born in Paraguay (or wherever)?<br /><br />The Robertses can't even use the stale "saved from abortion" line, as that procedure still isn't legal in Ireland.<br /><br />Tut. Tut. Tut.MrsTarquinBiscuitbarrelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00479830264284065679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-49019131581295239212013-07-02T11:12:09.381-04:002013-07-02T11:12:09.381-04:00From Wikipedia:
While investigating Roberts' ...From Wikipedia:<br /><br />While investigating Roberts' life, the New York Times was accused of attempting to unseal records detailing the 2000 adoption by Roberts and his wife of two infants born in Ireland[6] via a Latin American country.[7] The Times denied any attempts to unseal legal records and stated that "[o]ur reporters made initial inquiries about the adoptions" and "[t]hey did so with great care, understanding the sensitivity of the issue."<br /><br />The Times was condemned by the National Council for Adoption, "NCFA denounces, in the strongest possible terms, the shocking decision of the New York Times to investigate the adoption records of Justice John Roberts' two young children. The adoption community is outraged that, for obviously political reasons, the Times has targeted the very private circumstances, motivations, and processes by which the Roberts became parents."[8]<br /><br /><b>The reasons for the adoption happening in the unnamed Latin American country remain unclear, though it was noted that the Irish 1991 Adoption Act only allows adoption of children born in Ireland by people resident in Ireland.</b>Lorraine Duskyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18285341379272250245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-20411089899558922402013-07-02T11:09:27.679-04:002013-07-02T11:09:27.679-04:00Dear Anon, thank you for leaving your thoughts her...Dear Anon, thank you for leaving your thoughts here, and we're glad you and your father connected so well. <br /><br />Although this case hangs on a thread, and that thread can be criticized, what is important is what you understand: that a child needs his or her own people, whenever possible. <br /><br />As far I understand about Roberts: Since adopting Irish born children out of the country to be adopted, he flew the Irish mothers (didn't want tainted American blood, it appears) to a Latin American country so the children could be born there and legally adopted. So while he didn't break the law, he unethically skirted it as much as possible. Since one's connection to adoption influences how one thinks about this so massively, he should have recused himself from offering an opinion on this decision. <br /><br />Since this court is dominated now by conservatives, after two terms of George Bush, I think we can thank Ralph Nadar for this decision, since without him, Gore would have been president and his apointees would not think like John Roberts and Samuel Alito. Lorraine Duskyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18285341379272250245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-23689614630634716792013-07-02T00:13:29.036-04:002013-07-02T00:13:29.036-04:00It should be noted that Scalia has 9 biological ch...It should be noted that Scalia has 9 biological children...Roberts has 2 children adopted from Ireland under suspicious circumstances...I have tried to read all I can about this adoption (from Ireland through Latin America) but can only find bits and pieces.<br /><br />This is about money and ownership. The Copabiancos can't see past what they want, what they believe their money can give to see how important this biological connection between this dad and his daughter is.<br /><br />I am 47 years old and have only begun to see how my adoption has really affected me the past couple of years. I am sensitive to this as I met my father last year and feel such a connection to him and him to me. He is my father. I know that all stories don't have this kind of ending ours does but I am blessed. My dad didn't get to know about me and is much like Dusten. I would guess he would not have been in a position to parent and raise me then, but he would have had the chance to make that decision for himself.<br /><br />I really used to believe that fathers love their children because of a connection to the mother. This can be the case I would guess but not in mine. My dad loves me for me. He does not view me as a possession.<br /><br />I am praying for some kind of clarity for the court...I don't know what is next, but I am confident that this child needs her people.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-3519414258332103852013-06-29T13:46:22.579-04:002013-06-29T13:46:22.579-04:00Casey Family Programs, Child Welfare League of Ame...Casey Family Programs, <b>Child Welfare League of America and Children’s Defense Fund</b> expressed disappointment regarding today’s U.S. Supreme Court decision affecting the Indian Child Welfare Act (ICWA) as the guiding law when determining the well-being of an Indian child in a custody dispute.<br /><br />David Sanders, Casey Family Programs’ executive vice president, said the ruling threatened to undermine principles that represent the gold standard in child welfare.<br /><br />Child welfare organizations expressed relief that the Supreme Court’s decision did not strike down ICWA in its entirety. However, they view the decision as a step backward for children and families.Lorraine Duskyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18285341379272250245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-42562211114776548852013-06-27T13:11:40.314-04:002013-06-27T13:11:40.314-04:00I think the world might be ending - I am actually ...I think the world might be ending - I am actually agreeing with Antonin Scalia on something. <br /><br />But seriously, his paragraph you included here is spot on. This father wants to raise his daughter, and he should be able to do so, period. h2o_girlnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-60667877936745148192013-06-26T22:13:36.059-04:002013-06-26T22:13:36.059-04:00Mothers who want to prevent the father from raisin...Mothers who want to prevent the father from raising their children don't want to be involved with the child at all. That's easier to do if she is adopted by strangers. In this case, the first mother is to blame. Not all mothers are good people. <br /><br /> Viktorianoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-84068340940103237342013-06-26T21:41:18.949-04:002013-06-26T21:41:18.949-04:00Anonymous: I would hope you would go back and read...Anonymous: I would hope you would go back and read more about the facts of the case. The lawyer for the Capobianos was sleazy all the way around; Dusten Brown thought the natural mother of his child was raising her, which he did not object to. What he did object to--and did as soon as he realized the papers pushed on him in a parking lot were--consented to the adoption. <br /><br />Where is the decency of the adopters, the Capobiancos? They lack basic human decency. If they had a smidgeon of it, they would stop this insane demand that a little girl who has a father who wants her be returned to them. There is a special place in hell for people like them. <br /><br />This is a child we are talking about, not a ping pong ball; natural parents have the right to raise their own children, unless they are proven to be unfit, which clearly does not apply here. Only in a cockeyed world would adopters--cruel and immoral--go to such lengths to take a child away from her natural parents.Lorraine Duskyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18285341379272250245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-66998725085325012302013-06-26T19:02:10.642-04:002013-06-26T19:02:10.642-04:00Shame on the adoptive parents for continuing to fi...Shame on the adoptive parents for continuing to fight. Once the baby left their home, they should have let it go. To make this child move yet again would be devasting and incredibly damaging to her.Annehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06222871697045360999noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-27572917285067664002013-06-26T18:45:11.021-04:002013-06-26T18:45:11.021-04:00The First Mother in this case chose not to raise h...The First Mother in this case chose not to raise her baby. The First Father in this case chose not to even say he was the First Father until he decided he didn't like who the adoptive parents would be.<br />Should we now stop "saving" unwed mothers from their children and instead start "saving" them from their decisions to have their children raised by someone else?<br />I guess the posters here don't think this particular First Mother had the right to make any decisions for the child she had been abandoned to raise alone.<br />I guess the posters here don't think the First Father maintains infinite and permanent rights, even after refusing to be the First Father for the first four months.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-80812694942376385302013-06-26T17:18:13.692-04:002013-06-26T17:18:13.692-04:00"The Court did think it important to note tha..."The Court did think it important to note that they were at the birth, and Matt Capobianco cut the cord, a practice we find reprehensible as it creates an atmosphere of consent to the adoption when the mother is in the throes of having just given birth."<br /><br />It also does not make it any less difficult to be adopted for the child. We seem to have a new kind of thinking in this country that the sooner the child is connected with the adoptive parents the more they will become her 'real' and only parents. Not true.<br /><br />Also, this supposed 'best interests of the child' argument never seems to take into account the realities of being an adoptee versus being raised in one's bio-family. Veronica, like many other adoptees, may always have a question mark over whether she truly belongs in the adoptive family, and is really considered a full member of the family. She will be subjected to this stigma by others. And it is even likely that there will be adoptive family members who won't fully accept her as family. I can't imagine why anyone would want to subject a child to this when she has a loving, natural father who wants to raise her.<br /><br />I have to agree with BettyJ1951 that "SHE is the one that will pay the highest price emotionally & psychologically!"<br /><br />This has been sent back to the state and previously the South Carolina Supreme Court ruled in favor of the natural father. Let's hope that they do so again.Robinnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-73523446321941803772013-06-26T16:33:29.243-04:002013-06-26T16:33:29.243-04:00Everything's reversed. Up is down,left is righ...Everything's reversed. Up is down,left is right ,in is out,through the looking glass. We the people work for the government, not the government for we the people,That's not the way it's supposed to be.What ever happened to "of the people,by the people, for the people?" We are all becoming slaves to a corporate-government-banking system that is watching and recording everything we say and do-and taking our children away if we don't tow the line. This isn't crazy anymore They can't drug us into submission anymore. This is real and we're all waking up-finally. Happy 4th of July everyone!+ Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-77658118673410226222013-06-26T15:31:38.452-04:002013-06-26T15:31:38.452-04:00@BettyJ1951 are you an adoptee of Indian descent? ...@BettyJ1951 are you an adoptee of Indian descent? regardless, thank you for your strong words on the matter.<br /><br />My mother is close in age with you.. born 1954 and she was in foster homes her whole life. Taken from her reserve and put in residential schools as part of a Canadian government incentive to "assimilate" Native culture into white. I know similar atrocities have gone on in the US which is why the ICWA exists. It's too bad it didn't for my mother. She doesn't know the language or culture she was born into. She does not know the names or faces of many of her own siblings. She is trying to reconnect and learn as much as she can, but you can't ignore the hurt around the fact that she has to make an EFFORT to do this as an adult because she was stolen from the culture she should have grown up with.<br /><br />As her daughter and someone of Native descent myself, I also struggle with not knowing my own heritage. I study and research but it's not the same as LIVING it naturally. I have a government card granting me Indian health benefits, but I've never lived on a reserve or properly experienced my own birth right for these benefits. I feel like a cheat. I also long to know about my living aunts and uncles...and my grandparents who have passed and I will never meet. It's been increasingly unsettling lately that I don't know who my relatives are or what they look like. I found a second cousin on facebook recently and saw a photo of her grandmother (my aunt) and just cried. She looks like my mother. I feel a lot of pain as a result of my mother being taken away from her culture, but she feels it tenfold. There are many people like us and this is only scratching the surface of the issues around this... there's also the matter of the abusive foster homes, abusive nuns at the catholic assimilation schools and that lasting impact of all that... but that's a different story.<br /><br />I remember when the Dr. Phil show covered this story and had a few people trying to argue against the validity of the ICWA and saying it's not relevant to people now like it was 50 years ago. Bullshit. Bull.shit. It absolutely is. <br /><br />I said earlier that I'm glad the ICWA was Mr. Brown's saving grace, but that adoption and paternal laws shouldn't be so faulty in the first place to make him resort to the ICWA. I still stand by that. But the issues of both paternal rights AND the ICWA are very compelling in their own right. Put them together and I don't even see why this issue is still in court. It's just because of pride and entitlement. Really disappointing that the American justice system is putting that first.Adoption Allynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-29122764879594865842013-06-26T15:18:01.909-04:002013-06-26T15:18:01.909-04:00Anderson Cooper's position is certainly not si...Anderson Cooper's position is certainly not simply because he is gay, in fact it might have nothing to do with that at all. AC is a CIA asset. It serves the purpose of a government bent on control to have a population as alienated and isolated as possible. Breaking down family bonds has been a consistent theme in this country's culture now for several decades. Being an adoptee is an alienating experience. It also teaches the adoptee that any bond - no matter how close and personal (mother/child) - can be broken with impunity and for superficial reasons and this behavior has societal support. <br /><br />Relationship bonds and a sense of community and brotherhood with our fellows are not rewarded in our culture today for political and social reasons. This is why adoption in USA is so promoted. Strong, cohesive families have been (and continue to be) under attack as they reduce the influence of the state over the masses.Bethnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-9865427866893776412013-06-26T14:46:44.866-04:002013-06-26T14:46:44.866-04:00Very disheartening. I hope the best interests of t...Very disheartening. I hope the best interests of the child prevail in S.C and Dusten Brown gets to keep his daughter. <br /><br />The Anderson Cooper interview with the Capobiancos seemed dumb and biased to me too, but I don't think it fair to impugn his motives by suggesting that he is prejudiced in their favor simply because he is gay.<br /><br />In his interview with Wes Hutchins and Jake Strickland: <br />http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WPqjPuU5f4M <br />he expressed strong support for the parental rights of biological fathers.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-83335245262354461362013-06-26T14:16:55.878-04:002013-06-26T14:16:55.878-04:00I am an ADULT ADOPTEE of 62 yrs, and I KNOW what t...I am an ADULT ADOPTEE of 62 yrs, and I KNOW what the adoption bureaucracy did to ME emotionally & psychologically as a child, and I PITY this child! <br /><br />I think it's A SHAME that this little girl is being used as a RAG DOLL in a SICK bureaucratic game of Adoption TUG o' WAR! SHE is the one that will pay the highest price emotionally & psychologically! <br /><br />OK, IF the adoptive parents get to keep her...THEY should be MADE to expose her to the Native American Culture of her heritage, and NOT be allowed to hide it from her! And, by virtue of that...her birth father should be allowed to be a part of her life as she grows up ti INSURE that she GETS the exposure to her heritage!BettyJ1951noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-82324134089177126342013-06-26T13:29:53.477-04:002013-06-26T13:29:53.477-04:00Anderson Cooper's mother Gloria Vanderbilt was...Anderson Cooper's mother Gloria Vanderbilt was the subject of a mega child custody battle with her paternal aunt and grandmother (the Vanderbilts) on one side and her widowed mother on the other side. Guess who won? Money over motherhood!Jane Edwardshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09715622112694146946noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-81169571849778665542013-06-26T13:03:23.296-04:002013-06-26T13:03:23.296-04:00I had the very same thought-Cooper's burning u... I had the very same thought-Cooper's burning up with baby fever, hell, it was obvious, he redefined the word "biased"marywhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14614800798714082675noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-27726199681175590362013-06-26T12:32:13.460-04:002013-06-26T12:32:13.460-04:00Ugh how disappointing and devastating. Dusten Brow...Ugh how disappointing and devastating. Dusten Brown wants nothing more to be a father to his child. He was lied to and mislead and people have the nerve to act like HE is the bad guy? What is wrong with our world. While I agree with the ICWA and it's aim to preserve culture and family, I think it's messed up that his case even had to resort to that in the first place. Adoption laws and parental rights should be strong enough in the first place that the ICWA shouldn't need to be Mr. Brown's saving grace, but alas for his sake I'm glad it was. <br /><br />I take peace in this: <br /><br />"In other words, the case may not be resolved for years and in the meantime, Veronica may remain with her father."<br /><br />I don't see how any custodial court years from now could look at a walking, talking, thinking, non-toddler child and send her back to the "parents" from her years of childhood amnesia. But I've been disgusted and shocked with this case already..... time will tell.Adoption Allynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-3599830850529657952013-06-26T12:23:20.962-04:002013-06-26T12:23:20.962-04:00Tragic, horrific for this child and her father... ...Tragic, horrific for this child and her father... and for our nation. This ruling goes hand in hand with the gutting of Voter Rights proections. It not only shows disdain for natural parents, what is shows is favoritism toward White entitlement and disdain for all non-whites!! The Supremes have shown their hand to be as racist as Paula Deen, and far more powerful and scary.<br /><br />These two SC decisions, depsite the one win for gay rights, makes me DISGUSTED and embarrassed to call myself an American. Mirah Ribenhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13626873757236976251noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-79486262358083146912013-06-26T12:03:59.382-04:002013-06-26T12:03:59.382-04:00See update. See update. Lorraine Duskyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18285341379272250245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-19875855387599630442013-06-26T10:01:33.243-04:002013-06-26T10:01:33.243-04:00the pieces of paper have to go totally go see how ...the pieces of paper have to go totally go see how this started by a signature on a piece of paper.......they do it all the timme to a woman who has just birthed the child isplaced with the mother by god and that is where the child stays nocourt no piece of paper is smarter than god because god creates all of us in our mothers wombs and thaat is where chldren remain with their mothers thats whre children want to be not with anyone else.....they come through a woman who becomes their mother..........any instrument which allows a child to be taken from where god placed them will be abolished off of this earth......no one can buy a child we are freely born to our mothers al lof us freely given .......well none of us would be here in any job without our mtohers... no judge sits in a box able to make decisions without being born of a woman himself how dare they eveen suggest a chld should be with anyne but their mtoehrs....we are al born on this earth and we cant do anything withoutour mmother who gaveus our life..........any court who decrees a child should be with anyone but their mothers is CORRUPT AND ROTTEN TO THEE COREE..NO COURTS HAVE A PLACE IN A CHILDS RIGHT TO THEIR OWN MOTHERS............NOW THEY CAN LEAVE THE LANDS WITH THEIER STUPID LAWS AND MONEY AND THEEIR TRAGIC CASES OF PITTING PARENT AGAINST PARENT THE FAMILY COURT IS THE MOST EVIL PPLACE ON THIS EARTH.....NOW THEYCAN ABOLISH THEM ALL LCHILDREN ARE TO REMAIN WHERE GOD PLACES THEM NATURALLY.........AND DONT TELL ME THERE IS NO GOD......CREATION IS AMAZING AND GOD WE RE ALL PART OF GOD AND I CAN GUARNTEE YOU THERE IS ONLYONE WAYONTO THIS EARTH AND THAT IS TRHOUGH OUR MOTHERS...GOD MADE ALL OF US IN OUR MOTHERS WOMBS NONE OF US ARE HERE WITHOUT OOUR MOTHERS.....WOMEN BIRTH NOT MEN WE BIRTH THEM TOO...HOW DARE THEY SIT IN JUDGEMENT OF THEIR OWN MOTHERS.........THEY CAN DARN WELL SHUT UP SHOP AND NEVER TAKE CHILDREN FROM WHERE GOD PLACES THEM OR THEY ARE ANSWERABLE TO GOD THE LOT OF THEMWHEN THEY CROSS OVER.......Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-4678352674827612222013-06-26T07:21:31.668-04:002013-06-26T07:21:31.668-04:00Note: "The court did think it important to no...Note: "The court did think it important to note that they were at the birth, and Matt Capobianco cut the cord, a practice we find reprehensible as it creates an atmosphere of consent to the adoption when the mother is in the throes of having just given birth."<br /><br />So what does this statement say for Grandparents such as myself? Shouldn't I then have been allowed placement of my Granddaughter Isabella, whom I helped deliver and also cut her cord, not to mention I took care of her Mother throughout her extremely high risk pregnancy, whereas the Health center she went to did nothing to make sure Isabella was born alive and healthy? I was the one who made sure Mother and child were taken care of and where did it get me or Isabella for the matter? Separated at birth by a greedy corrupt system!unhappygrammyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12533694926276373256noreply@blogger.com