tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post4910501739507281852..comments2024-03-27T20:48:39.389-04:00Comments on [Birth Mother] First Mother Forum: The right to know your origins in an inalienable right Lorraine Duskyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/18285341379272250245noreply@blogger.comBlogger26125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-27348376933058979752014-07-21T16:38:27.959-04:002014-07-21T16:38:27.959-04:00Thanks for this wonderful post, Jane. I enjoyed re...Thanks for this wonderful post, Jane. I enjoyed reading it ... and the comments. Such insight, knowledge, and common sense. Thank you again. -daughter of a NJ adopteeRunningTeacherMamahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00824325376493562025noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-24947517197010961892014-07-12T02:24:56.605-04:002014-07-12T02:24:56.605-04:00Hi Lori,
Relationships are mutual, but that was n...Hi Lori,<br /><br />Relationships are mutual, but that was not my point. I am referring to those who prevent me from accessing my OBC and learning from where I came because of their own personal fears. That's an overreach. Knowing my roots is extremely important to me and my kids.<br />Those who are against this and who redact their names from my document (which again is mine not theirs) lack character strengths .<br />I am not connecting "lack of character strengths" with relinquishment. Adoptees should not be prevented from our OBCs because we are in someone's closet, that was my point.<br />I am familiar with your many posts and you absolutely have an abundance of character and that is not what I am criticizing. It's the actions of those who prevent me from accessing what is mine, in addition to those that assume adoptees will act harmfully with this info who I have issue with. I truly apologize if I came off as insulting to your situation because I find you to be one that has shown such strength when faced with such disrespectful and treatment. Ajjahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15385063743910215737noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-32535836083190517362014-07-11T17:33:47.550-04:002014-07-11T17:33:47.550-04:00Ajja - actually, I think that knowing where you co...Ajja - actually, I think that knowing where you come from is fine.... but there is a point when it has to be mutual. And I did not have a lack of character strengths... but an abundance of them. I think that you need to realize that sometimes it wasn't our lack of strength, but our lack of support.... thank you.Lorihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05815710859859029536noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-63379504628134185062014-07-07T17:43:27.428-04:002014-07-07T17:43:27.428-04:00As a minor and a mother at the age of almost seven...As a minor and a mother at the age of almost seventeen I had little freedom to contract any contracts in 66. It was the ONLY contract a minor was allowed as our babies weren't allowed to have contact only at birth. I told my son after finding him I never had a lawyer, a judge, a courtroom to go before instead my rights,,,as a minor in my hospital bed paid for by my step thing..were to sign upon awakening from a 2 am delivery...social worker was a pariah...getting my baby for the next adopter. I had no alternative in the those days I could have ran off and been a hippy or became another pregnant young woman to provide a baby for an adopter. My son wasn't an orphan and very much wanted by me...but it was inevitable no welfare, no jobs, a young adult woman could barely get utilites established...in an apt much less live on her own. Doomed for adoption machine...<br /><br /> Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-6931131127076668952014-07-06T22:29:02.686-04:002014-07-06T22:29:02.686-04:00Hi This the first time I have ever found a site li...Hi This the first time I have ever found a site like this and I am so Happy to have found<br />you. I am a birth mother I did not give up my child. She was taken from me by CPS.She was about 9 months when this nightmare begin.She was almost 2 1/2 when<br />when to my parental rights away. I have know idea if she adopted or not. Until today I did not know she could not by law find me.I thought I was the one who could not find her. Dawn Marie was born July 13,1969 at Mease Hospital in Dunedin Fl.Her birthday is coming again ,she will be 44ys old.My story of what happened of why<br />she was taken I will explain at another time it is still as painful now as when it took place so for now all I want is my daughter or me to be able to have the right to find each other. I believe she should have the right to find me. Every time I search I come <br />to a dead end. If she could get her OBC she would find me. I have lived in the same neighborhood since 1969.She has sister that has been looking for her also. If anyone can help me I will give more information. <br />MaryDeChateletsnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-59700674887506619802014-07-05T16:11:45.718-04:002014-07-05T16:11:45.718-04:00I think your " birthmother " at 11:33 is...I think your " birthmother " at 11:33 is a fraud.......Jan Louisehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01275804204213681445noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-22477462118533088472014-07-05T09:43:28.629-04:002014-07-05T09:43:28.629-04:00I replied to this earlier, but my reply did not sh...I replied to this earlier, but my reply did not show up! Thanks for the link. I agree with the entire paper.Julia Emilynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-32621006536361225792014-07-05T03:38:37.313-04:002014-07-05T03:38:37.313-04:00Thanks for this link. What you quote is so true. I...Thanks for this link. What you quote is so true. I have always said that the adoptee is the only party that had no hand in the decision making. As infants, life decisions were made for us by our first mother, possibly her parents, and by our adoptive parents. The little, blank slate of a baby was passed around from one adult to another like a sack of potatoes. Then the little baby grew up. And what a mess it has become!Julia Emilynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-60445493866679939872014-07-05T02:57:21.269-04:002014-07-05T02:57:21.269-04:00It's all so maddening, especially since the cl...It's all so maddening, especially since the claims of the "right of mothers for privacy" have been disproved by actual evidence, such as Elizabeth J. Samuels's "Surrender and Subordination: Birth Mothers and Adoption Law Reform" paper.<br /><br />One thing I consistently fail to see acknowledged by the anti-open records folk is the fact that records don't seal at relinquishment, but at the finalization of an adoption. If I'd never been adopted, and grown up in foster care, I'd still have my OBC and all my records. How can they argue "rights of mothers for privacy" in light of this? And the fact that records seal upon the finalization of an adoption should tell them just who sealed records were really for.<br /><br />zygotepariahnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-24544949374840747142014-07-04T22:04:46.109-04:002014-07-04T22:04:46.109-04:00I really like the conclusion drawn here:
http://s...I really like the conclusion drawn here:<br /><br />http://scholarship.law.wm.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1129&context=wmjowl<br /><br />stronger weight should be given to the adoptee's needs than to<br />those of the birth parents, for the parents had a choice in the<br />original adoption that the adoptee was not given - the option<br />of anonymity. The birth parents freely contracted away their<br />right to know who their child is, but the adoptee's rights were<br />signed away for him by his adoptive parents and the state.The Watchdoghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10474947740844875388noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-71356175070048514352014-07-04T21:28:11.366-04:002014-07-04T21:28:11.366-04:00I wonder if Anon was one of the Judges in the Alma...I wonder if Anon was one of the Judges in the Alma v. Mellon case. That would explain the reaction.The Watchdoghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10474947740844875388noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-12054841081791941002014-07-04T20:43:10.492-04:002014-07-04T20:43:10.492-04:00Sexual privacy??? we all have SEXUAL privacy whil...Sexual privacy??? we all have SEXUAL privacy while we are taking birth control, have an abortion but once another human being is born its not about sexual privacy anymore. Its about the rights of the human that was created and their ability to KNOW who they can from, who their ancestors were and most important what their true medical history is. you see, once you bring a person into this world another branch is added to the family tree and that has NOTHING to do with you having sex except for the fact that sex makes babies...but your privacy is busted once you give birth. Adoption does not and should not change that. the blood coursing through their bodies does not change just because they are adopted they are still a biological member of your family...like it or not. all you see is a "kid butting" against your rights. Sorry sweet cheeks...but I am middle-aged with children and grandchildren of my own. Have not been a kid for a long time and I will tell you my "rights" to my information are important...but what is more important is my children and grandchildren's RIGHTS to their information and being the mother and grandmother I am ...I will fight you for them to get what decisions they information need to be whole and have ALL the information they can get to have the power to make their own decisions about their lives based upon their biological information. Guess what else, its not anyone else's business to decide what is important for me and them to know, it is ours! BECAUSE someone gave birth to us..no other reason. what society thinks, what any of the mothers think is not the point..the point is that the adopted people and their descendants get the information they need to make informed choices about their own lives. NOT some woman's sexual privacy.dpennoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-76344863709142568052014-07-04T19:47:39.181-04:002014-07-04T19:47:39.181-04:00Yes. As of July 1, 2014, upon request and proof of...Yes. As of July 1, 2014, upon request and proof of identification, adult adoptees, adoptive parents of minor adoptees, custodial grandparents of minor adoptees, descendants of the adoptee and certain other eligible parties (with the adult adoptee's consent, or if the sought party is deceased), have direct access to copies of the amended birth certificate, original birth certificate, final decree of adoption, final order of relinquishment and/or order terminating parental rights, and social/medical history. For certain time periods (particularly adoptions finalized between 7/1/67 and 8/31/99), the State Registrar must wait until 1/1/16 to release OBCs, but other courts and state agencies have begun releasing these other documents, which are included in the statutory definition of "adoption records." Rich Uhrlaubhttp://www.aisctc.orgnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-32949529506638149102014-07-04T17:42:42.095-04:002014-07-04T17:42:42.095-04:00Thanks Rich,
Yes, we need to repeat: this over and...Thanks Rich,<br />Yes, we need to repeat: this over and over: signing a consent does not guarantee adoption and thus the sealing of the birth certificate.<br /><br />I understand the new CO law also allows adoptees access to portions of their court adoption file without a court order. Is this correct?Jane Edwardshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09715622112694146946noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-65225906980178698382014-07-04T16:04:51.375-04:002014-07-04T16:04:51.375-04:00Yes, I think so! I can't make heads nor tails ...Yes, I think so! I can't make heads nor tails out of that post !!!Julia Emilynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-50967095772040411702014-07-04T13:59:16.394-04:002014-07-04T13:59:16.394-04:00Gail, I am shooting off a virtual Roman candle to ...Gail, I am shooting off a virtual Roman candle to celebrate your comment, especially the last sentence.<br /><br />Happy fiftieth birthday, Civil Rights Act!! And many more!MrsTarquinBiscuitbarrelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00479830264284065679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-58316863171109622092014-07-04T13:56:39.886-04:002014-07-04T13:56:39.886-04:00Anon 9:31, are you drunk?
Signed, Mrs. "1 Mi...Anon 9:31, are you drunk?<br /><br />Signed, Mrs. "1 Million Lawyers"MrsTarquinBiscuitbarrelhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00479830264284065679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-14240715840380149652014-07-04T09:31:06.568-04:002014-07-04T09:31:06.568-04:00well sort of everyone is wrong the courts can deci...well sort of everyone is wrong the courts can decide all they want to however being the fact that these are just prima facie laws, and the fact that we are being treated as alien prisoners of war, being, Coerced by 1 million lawyers of the Bar Association, pretending to be a government, operating under the general orders of the lieber code, title 50 of the US Code, which were actually never ratified, under a 14th amendment that was actually never ratified as prr Congressional Record, and as for Congressional Record we are still under the Bankruptcy Act of 1933, the rule of law nor those who are agent all that law, which are private copyrighted intellectual material, we are a nation that creates Debt. animation who refused to allow those to use their inherent right, also operating under the situs trust, as our courts pertain to situs district, under the situs corporate charter, is how they transfer wealth. this pretend government who is really a corporation, has misled our nation and stolen our children at birth using their ancient Babylonian techniques you didn't tell that to the mothers, that they have given away their children. this is not only perjury but it is felony by deception of language on every front. every document created for you for the people is a document that creates debt. ladies and gentlemen they try to tell you that you are supposed to take care of yourself yet they own you when you register the child at birth just like you register a car or any other property that you own you are actually registering the spoils of war. the government owns us, and our property as per the situs trust, and what they do is packaged everything into a nice little securities in bundles via the use of dummy trust account and sell you the world. this information is located if you look up the words Cestui Que Vie trust, under positive law, under rights, chapter 100: under canon law. our nation a worker bee work under a foreign entity and relinquish their rights when they pledge their of office<br /> do not let them fool you when they say the rule of law is law it is not it is a ruleand they are making up the rules as they go along they can change the rules at any instance to make you believe that it is locked because they say that they are the authority and you are the pauper or rather the slave.those agents are all members of the bar all the way to the Chief Justice and they are listed as alien enemy property custodians their second name is a lawyer.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-82339851969040288302014-07-04T08:28:20.414-04:002014-07-04T08:28:20.414-04:00No one should be denied their ancestry simply bec...No one should be denied their ancestry simply because it might embarrass someone. Everyone has the right to know who they are. <br /><br />“There can be no legally protected interest in keeping one’s identity secret from one’s biological offspring; parents and child are considered co-owners of the information regarding the event of birth…. The birth parents’ interest in reputation is not alone deserving of constitutional protection.”- U.S. Department of Health, Education and Welfare (HEW) about the proposed Model Adoption Act of 1980.<br /><br />This is basically the same decision as the court held in Oregon. But beyond what courts hold, denying the truth of one's origins to that person is a gross abrogation of that person's right to live as a free man. <br /><br />Anon, though it may be difficult, I hope you find the charity in your heart to tell others about your secret son or daughter. You will probably find more compassion than you expect. We have all been through the act of telling, and come out the other side stronger. Lorraine Duskyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18285341379272250245noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-20311206729116252542014-07-04T07:40:24.890-04:002014-07-04T07:40:24.890-04:00@anon, no, you do not have the right to deny anoth...@anon, no, you do not have the right to deny another person his or her right to know his birth origin. My heart aches for your child knowing that he or she has a mother like you. And kindly refrain from using the pronoun "we." I'm a first mother and know firsthand that mothers like you are, fortunately, extremely rare. Gailnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-61858497008924223112014-07-04T05:57:16.676-04:002014-07-04T05:57:16.676-04:00Above anonymous. You have the right not to parent....Above anonymous. You have the right not to parent. That right was exercised and the child was relingquished. Finished. That does not mean I lose my right to know where I came from. It does not mean my children lose that right too. <br /><br />Adoptees cannot be asked to compensate for another's lack of character strengths in dealing with another's life choices. <br /><br />I encourage you, and all with similar views, to watch the YouTube video on being in the closet at the bottom of <br />http://www.adoptionbirthmothers.com/thinking-more-about-the-birthmother-closet/<br /><br />All a closet is is a hard conversation. We all have these in life and adoptees and their children must not lose their heritage and self knowledge because one lacks these character strengths .<br />Ajjahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15385063743910215737noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-64341797692678507822014-07-04T04:06:11.343-04:002014-07-04T04:06:11.343-04:00Jane, this is a great post, filled with common sen...Jane, this is a great post, filled with common sense. As I was reading I said to myself: if only we can get the legislators to read this, it might open their eyes.<br /><br />Then I read the first comment.<br /><br />Anon: you proclaim "I have rights, I have rights !!" I have the right not be make myself known...etc. Then you tell us you gave up your rights when you relinquished. Do you even know what you are saying?<br /><br />This is what adoption reform is up against. Everyone, especially in NY, seems to believe the first mother is hiding and has the right to privacy. It doesn't matter that adoptees and first mothers are finding each other every day. It doesn't matter that all sorts of "private" information is posted on social media, seen by everyone on the planet. It doesn't matter that DNA is matching people and helping even black market adoptees find their families. Apparently, none of this matters, because the powers that be think our archaic laws will provide privacy that was never promised to a first mother to begin with.<br /><br />How do we make people who have no idea what they are talking about see common sense? This has been going on for 18 years. Not too many of us have another 18 years to devote to it. It's like talking to a brick wall.Julia Emilynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-49091365686276618492014-07-04T03:39:39.317-04:002014-07-04T03:39:39.317-04:00Anonymous, you don't speak for me.
I was neve...Anonymous, you don't speak for me.<br /><br />I was never promised anonymity. I would never have wanted it.<br />I always wanted to know where my son was, and for him to know me.<br /><br />I simply wasn't given that choice due to the closed adoption system.<br />My son wasn't given that choice either.<br /><br />Do not speak for me.<br /><br />Cherrynoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-69545949302684905062014-07-04T00:52:32.039-04:002014-07-04T00:52:32.039-04:00Thanks for writing this piece Jane. Summarizing t...Thanks for writing this piece Jane. Summarizing the TN and OR higher court rulings was one of the things that helped Colorado legislators understand the proper legal "balance of interests." Once most people read/hear it, the lights come on: Though adoption is generally an option available to a birth/first parent, they do not have a fundamental right to have their child adopted (because someone else must consent to the adoption). Therefore, they cannot have a correlative fundamental right to have their child adopted under circumstances that guarantee their anonymity from their own offspring. Sometimes adoptions disrupt, causing the OBC to once again become the child's identity document. Courts have always had the "right" to open an adoption file (however infrequently it may happen) without the consent of any party to the adoption. Any adoption worker who told a birth/first parent that they could never be found or contacted did them a tremendous disservice. Many moms in our group have said words to this effect: "The pain of carrying my secret for forty years was much, much greater than any embarrassment that came from telling it." Thanks to all the mothers who've shown so much courage to advocate for the well-being of their surrendered children. It made all the difference in Colorado. And by the way, as of July 1, birth/first parents who relinquished in CO can now obtain a copy of the OBC they signed. Other relinquishment records become available to parents August 7. See our website for more details!Rich Uhrlaubhttp://www.aisctc.orgnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-574300303008890516.post-17521382372930719812014-07-04T00:20:18.860-04:002014-07-04T00:20:18.860-04:00It doesn't matter whether you agree or disagre...It doesn't matter whether you agree or disagree, Anon, all the courts which have considered the issue have sided for the adoptee. You gave up your right to be your child's parent but your child did not give up his right to know his original identity.<br /><br />You ought to look yourself in the mirror and figure out why you're so angry and why you want to inflict pain on the innocent being your brought into the world!Jane Edwardshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09715622112694146946noreply@blogger.com