' [Birth Mother] First Mother Forum: 'I'm Having Their Baby' turns into 'I'm keeping MY baby'

Saturday, July 28, 2012

'I'm Having Their Baby' turns into 'I'm keeping MY baby'

I'm Having Their Baby is yet example of how a thriving business (adoption) can spawn one television show after another, especially when around every corner is someone searching for their 15 minutes of fame, even if 13 of them are spent in tears.

The Oxygen channel (started by Oprah, now owned by NBC Universal) features this latest weep-fest for the weary, and lord knows, I am tired of stupid television shows that appear to glorify or encourage adoption. I say "appear" to because I am not sure that this one does because the mothers-to-be spend a lot of time with the blues: Claudia hates her baby daddy--he has six other kids by four women, and he cavalierly indicates he might fight her for custody, which you know at the time he says it that he is just being a shit for the camera and his ex, who is only weeks away from giving birth.

Mary, the other subject in this episode, had an affair with an old boy friend after she and her husband broke up; now there is a slim possibility (in Mary's mind) that she and her husband might get back together...but she is carrying the baby of the ex-BF, and no way the husband wants anything BUT a divorce.

Enough about plot, let's jump right to the informative parts: Mary chooses a "loving" couple, Jeremy and Nicole who have been trying to "have a baby" since 2006 and "lost a baby" in 2007. When Jeremy and Nicole meet Pregnant Mary it is love at first sight. "You're so beautiful," gushes Nicole as she envelopes Mary in a huge body hug. Mary smiles and smiles. She likes these people. She says a couple of times throughout her segments that her baby needs a mother and a father. "I have been praying for this birth mother out there, and now I can pray for Mary," Nicole enthuses. Praying for "this birth mother out there?"

Hmmm. What I heard was Please God send me a birth mother who wants to give us her baby. Doubtful that she is praying in general for pregnant teens and women to find a way to keep their babies and have good mental health as well as a sunny prognosis for the rest of their lives. Obviously she is not reading blogs with heads like this: "How can adoption be less horrific on first mothers?" 

Because if she did, she would have to be praying for all first/birth/real mothers to keep their babies and have the resources to do so. See: Giving Up Your Baby? which lays out all the reasons that women who opt to have a baby should keep their baby.

Despite fears and tears, Mary's not-quite-ex makes it clear the marriage is over. He never says he will take her back if she gives the baby up. Mary stays on still on track with this cute couple, Nicole and Jeremy.

Until she invites them to the sonogram when it is likely they will learn the sex of the baby. Mary's mother is there too.  IT'S A BOY! Yeah! While Mary is absorbing the pictures of the sonogram of the baby she is planning to give away, Nicole is practically jumping for joy, and it appears that the sonogram nurse gave a blue rubber bracelet (to indicate the sex, how cute) to Nicole before she thought to give one to the mother-to-be, lying silently there, her belly exposed like a giant beached whale. "We don't have any boy names," says Nicole. "Our toilet seat will never be the same." Blah, blah, blah. Mary's mother, the grandmother of baby-boy-to-be, says nothing. Mary says nothing, she just looks pensive.

"What's this curlicue?" asks Nicole of something on the sonogram screen.

"The umbilical cord." Oh. Nicole is not so excited over that. 

What is clear to Mary and to viewers is that as soon as the baby is as real as a fuzzy sonogram, Nicole is only interested--and why not?--in the baby! She wants a baby, not a birth mother and a baby--Nicole's elation totally belies any real concern she has for Mary's feelings. Nicole's prayers are being answered!

Handmaid`s Tale
Chilling book about women having babies for others....
But that enthusiam does come back to bite Nicole because...Mary says to the camera how "minimized" she felt at the sonogram, and decides she doesn't feel right about Nicole and Jeremy any more. She picks another couple from the list of prospective adoptive parents (PAPs) but chooses not to meet them.

And what do you know, after giving birth and spending two days with her baby, after spending a nearly sleepless night, she tells the social worker she decides not to give him up at all, to anyone. She tells the camera that once she made the decision to keep her baby, she felt "overwhelming joy" and "closure," and though she has a fear of the unknown, she only has to answer to herself and "it feels good."I breathed a sigh of relief.

Lesson: If you are thinking of giving up your baby, invent a situation where you can see how the prospective adopters react to the thought of the baby without you in the picture. For Mary, inviting the PAPs to the sonogram was a good thing, because she could see how quickly their concern for her turned immediately into a focus only on the baby. At the same time, she, at 25, was already feeling very connected to this baby of hers, and was strong enough to cut the imaginary cord with the...PAPs before she felt more indebted to them.

The other story deals with Claudia, 20, who was adopted at six from Haiti, and while she is sad at the prospect of giving up her baby, wants to go to school, something she does not deem possible if she keeps her baby. She says that her poor and overburdened parents in Haiti gave her up "for a better life" and she is going to do that too. And she does. Her adoptive parents are never shown.

Lesson: Being adopted begets more adoption. Don't I know it. For readers new to FMF, my daughter whom I gave up also gave up a daughter for adoption, 20 years almost to the day later. While many parents of young girls encourage adoption--fellow blogger Jane's own relative did--I am supposing that adopted daughters in general way get way less support for keeping a child than do biological daughters. Grandparents of children related to them cannot help but feel more connected to these babies than to children they are not biologically related to. I often wonder about the fall-back plans of adoptive parents, particularly single mothers: if something were to happen to them and make them unable to raise their adopted children, do relatives immediately step in, as they are likely to in normal, non-adoptive situation? I know one single adoptive mother, and I know for a fact that her elderly father could not have taken on the child, and her mother was an alcoholic. The girl is off to college this year. The grandfather was roundly against the adoption initially, but he has turned out to be a good grandfather; the grandmother died years ago. I cannot imagine who would have taken the girl, adopted from China, if something had happened to her mother.

I remember one statistic that said that adoptees were seven times more likely than non-adoptees to give up a child for adoption, and I suppose part of the reason is there in the missing link of DNA to the grandparents, and lack of support for keeping the child. They got a child through adoption, so...and the relatives saying of the pregnant teen: she's just like her [real] mother [i.e. a slut],  what are we supposed to do, raise this bastard like our own grandchild? If you think I am being harsh here, you haven't been listening to what people actually say....

Will I watch more of these shows? Not if I can help it. However, their proliferation (Sixteen and Pregnant, Be My Baby) is an indicator of how thoroughly the idea of adoption has become infused in society today. The message today is: Can't get pregnant? Get a child from someone else. Surely there are hundreds, thousands! of girls dying to have you raise their babies. Wrong.

I know I am being flip about this, I am sure that the pain of being unable to conceive is heart-breaking, but that gives no one the "right" to another's child. Life is not fair. No one has a baby that "was meant" for someone else. No baby grows in the "wrong tummy." It is wrong to "pray" for a birth mother if you are praying that she makes the decision to give you her baby.* Adoptive parents do not have God on their side. Adoption is sometimes necessary, but it is, as one adoptee wrote in a memoir, Second Choice.

While Jane and I gave up our babies in secrecy and shame, today it is quite different, but the message the young women get is the same rationale we heard decades ago: a baby deserves two parents; give up your baby so he can have what you cannot give him: two parents, or at least, more money. It is just as reprehensible a message today as it was yesterday. Unless there are extreme extenuating circumstances, A BABY DESERVES HIS MOTHER'S LOVE. His real mother's love.

Okay, shoot me for not using PC adoption lingo. Incidentally, Bethany Christian Services is once again the agency featured, as it is in Sixteen and Pregnant. The fact that adoption is papered over with religious overtones make me gag. Odd how many babies lose their mothers because of God's will, isn't it? Doesn't She know what's she's doing?  --lorraine

In some weird folly of the gods, ever time I try to download a graphic from the show--a line suggestive of a pregnant belly, with the words, I'm Having Your Baby inside, the screen freezes and I have to shut down the computer. I give up. FYI: Marley has written a fab post about these noxious shows at Daily Bastardette:  I'm Having Their Baby: Bowling for Babies Redux. 

*In terms of praying, I went to a link that one of our readers suggested, and found an adoptive mother writing this:
 "I find myself thinking "I am the only one on the planet who's kid's birth mom isn't pg again within 2 years of having her 1st pg." OMG I am so selfish!!! I know that she is routinely taking reliable birth control, and even if they did get pg again, birth dad said that baby would be "for them."
I would LOVE a full bio sibling to my AS. He is so beautiful and crazy and fun and I just love him so darn much!!! I find myself dreaming of a little girl that look like him Or a rowdy little brother. His young birth parents are still together and very happy together. There are some environmentally induced special needs his birth parents have that make it unlikely they could ever parent on their own, even though they are great people.

I would just love a full bio sib for my son
Thanks for listening."

What to say? Words fail me. The nightmare of tomorrow is here now. The Handmaid's Tale (Everyman's Library) (left) by celebrated Canadian writer Margaret Atwood is at once scathing satire, dire warning, and a tour de force. It is unexpected, horrifying, sometimes funny and altogether convincing. Who will control women's bodies in the future? What is the meaning of free will? Also made into a movie (right) of the same name, starring Natasha Richardson.

At age three days Robert Andersen, M.D., and author of Second Choice: Growing Up Adopted (below) was sold through the black market for $250.00. "A sensitive, moving, intelligent, and much needed contribution to adoption literature." -- Betty Jean Lifton, author of Lost and Found, the Adoption Experience. Another adoptee wrote at Amazon: " many golden nuggets of truth I found and returned to again and again were tremendously useful to me." 

Order by clicking on links or the picture of the jacket. Thankx. I found both books good reads--for different reasons, of course. The movie is an honest rendering of the book, perhaps even more prescient about the future--as we know it today. 

From FMF:  Giving Up Your Baby?
and previous post: 
An adoptive mother asks "How can adoption be less horrific on first mothers?"
and PAPs, don't miss: The Trauma of being adopted


  1. ianas, but i can't help but wonder; how much of this adoption begetting adoption has to be with unconscious identity with their lost mother? are women unconsciously following in their mother's footsteps in an attempt to understand what we went through, and who we are because of it?

    as i said... i am not a shrink. i'm just wondering out loud.

  2. Lorriane,

    How sad that studies show adoptees are more likely to give their babies up...I agree it might be the grandparents but i also think that these adoptees have no clue and are still in the brainwashed phase of things. "It was SOOO wonderful for me ,so it must be ok for my child...that and the ole reg coercion that goes on. They are sitting ducks.

    I can tell you in NO uncertian terms that being an adoptee made me MORE determined to not EVER give a baby up. NEVER crossed my mind...it would have been giving away my only blood...nope...didn't happen. And yes, I was in that position! I have 5 children and often thought what iwould do if they ever had a child earlyier then they were ready..adoption NEVER a factor...have 4 boys, often thought what would happen if they got a girl "in the famiy way"...and they were talking about adoption. I would fight to keep them. thats MY blood they would be given to stranges. Don't care how "wonderful" they are...I now a few other adoptees that feel the same way...my sister, my 2 brothers and then some i found on line.

  3. Very thoughtful post--evokes in me many thoughts. For one, let's not kid ourselves that bio relatives are ready, either, to promise to take over raising a single mother's child. I remember telling my brother, some years after I'd yielded my first chile to adoption, that I felt ready to, should something to my brother and his wife, raise their daughter--to which he said his wife's sister had already promised, "and she's so maternal"; but when my second child, whom I raised alone, was little and I asked my brother would they raise him if something happened to me, he downright refused--in front of the child, at that. --Second thing--I thought my first son's not having kids (so far, anyhow) might be related to his adoptive parents somehow, but neither my second son nor my niece have (so far) had kids either, so maybe this lack of bearing children is, rather, a generational thing? A fear of climate change, of bringing a child into a desperate time, etc.

  4. I also wonder if our daughters do not repeat what they believe was normal for us. It is a thought that torments me. I also can't begin to understand how anyone can assume that these shows are reality... sigh, it never ends does it?

  5. The producers of this show insist it's a documentary and not a reality show. All I can do is say Ugh!

    I am also surprised at studies that indicate female adoptees are more likely to surrender. In fact that shocks me because my female adopted friends all insist they would never give a baby up after growing up in a family where they never really fit in. They describe feelings more along the lines of what depen shares.

    1. I've been reunited with my.son for two years now, he's almost 22. He made the statement this weekend that he would like to have children of his own soon, he's far from ready. But he indicated he wanted that blood parent /child connection. He said he would never choose adoption and I completely support that statement.

  6. I too thought that no adoptee would ever give up a child, but that turns out not to be true. I'll do a post on how this came home to me; when I found out my daughter did it, I thought, oh god, she needed to experience what I did myself....it was such a sad and rude awakening.

  7. (That is terribly sad, Lorraine, that your daughter had to repeat the behavior and suffer!)

    (I suppose I better preface this with the premise that infertile couples were groomed by our society to think that if they can't produce their own children, they could just go down to the corner store and pick up a child - so you could say it's not their fault. You know, I'm getting pretty sick and tired of being politically correct and polite while my psyche is being downgraded and terrorized and discounted.)

    Let's be freakin' honest: All human beings would prefer to raise their own children!

    How is it that we have allowed the media, commerce, and religious nuts, to brainwash our society into thinking that it's perfectly ok for infertile people to take the children that don't belong to them!? Like the dumb bitch in the show was all pumped up freakishly looking at a young mom's private, intimate, sacred moment - gawking at the inside of a mother's reproductive organs! WTF is she doing in the ultrasound room of a stranger? Where is the dignity? What has happened to the self-worth and self-esteem of our beautiful young women and their parents?

    In adoption boundaries are crossed! Adoption is emotionally, and physically, incestuous - strangers have their tentacles where they're not supposed to be. Your tentacles don't belong in my reproductive organs!

    Astute mental health professionals have averred that adoption is by definition dysfunctional. More often than not, this dysfunction is passed down from one generation to the next generation; for example, like physical abuse is passed down from generation to generation until someone gets healthy and the chain is broken.

    Adoptees are taught, by their experience of abandonment, that family and blood is NOT important. Lineages and progenies mean nothing. Adoption teaches mother and child that they are not valued! Children are just strewn around to the highest bidder - like slavery time.

    I have heard that some adoptees can't wait to produce a child of their own so they'll have someone who is a part of them.

    I would like a television program showing how STRONG, loving, families embrace, and celebrate, new births whether the parents of the newborns are married or unmarried - instead of this incest.

    I'm ecstatic that societal mores are finally changing!

    And, to people who are offended by the above statements, I say, "How do you think we feel, we have to live it (those statements) every day!?

  8. I feel bad saying what I said in my previous comment to the people on this blog. I'd love to say it in the media, and to the adoption industry, and to the supposedly-religious nuts out there who love to separate families and subjugate their neighbors.

  9. How about a male adoptee — my son — giving up two children to adoption? He and his wife surrendered their second newborn when their marriage was shaky, and when they divorced surrendered their two year old. I'm told that her parents insisted upon it, to erase any sign of her early bad marriage. But I still wonder if it seemed somehow normal or fitting to my son?

  10. Caleigh, having to "live it every day" (I assume you mean having surrendered a child for adoption) does not mean one cannot be offended by some of your extreme statements. What is your story, that has led you to these conclusions? Are you reunited? Knowing where you are coming from might shed some light on your opinions.

  11. I had no idea that adopted children are more likely to choose adoption themselves. This is so sad and I now worry about my daughter.

  12. Thanks, for the props, Lo. I intend to write more about IHTB next week. I've been working out of town the last couple days.

    Friday night I saw part of the show in my room at the Comfort Inn in Dry Ridge, KY. I don't know if it was a re-run or a new ep. I wanted to watch the whole thing, but I was afraid my roommate would come back and I'd have to explain it to her--and that's too much trouble, so I switched over to Law and Order, my great TV addiction. This ep, oddly enough, was about reproductive predators who poke holes in condoms and knock up numerous women acting out their creepy narcissistic tendencies This charmer was a lawyer who'd fathered 47 children by hapless women around the world.

    Anyway, I did see clips of Claudia and it made me sick. Her whole problem is economics. The baby daddie can just hit the road. First he wanted her to get an abortion. Now he's threatening a custody suit which I doubt he'd wi with his track records of knock-em-up and run. And he doesn't have anything to do with his other kids. Wherewas Murray Povich? I understand Claudia. The new boyfriend seems to really care, but he's new and Claudia is right to be cautious. Otherwise she'll fall in a hole a never get out. The whole thing just pissed me off to no end. Money. I fully support women who don't want to be pregnant, don't want to give birth, don't want to parent. (That's me). But when you want to keep your and you're being forced to give it up due to what is hopefully a temporary money situation, that's bad and crazy--especially in the US. But then, we are at the end of empire, and the ruling elites are eating the est of us. This is just the beginning.

  13. Wow, Denise. That's just plain weird. I'd say your ex-DIL's relationship with her parents had more to do with this than a shaky marriage and divorce. They're real jackoffs.

    Back in the 1960s my ex-SIL got pregnant and married to her first husband--a real creep. They divorced about 3 years later, and he refused to pay child support--and his parents backed him up, saying he shouldn't have to spend his money on the kid.They themselves had no interest in the kid whatsoever.
    SIL's lawyer who, was an assistant county prosecutor charged him, and the cops went to the house to pick him up. Several times. He was never there no matter what the hour. (He didn't work as far as anybody could tell, so there was no other location to find him). My SIL called his parents one day and and one of them let it slip that they had a police scanner that they apparently took turns listening to, and whenever a cop was sent to pick him up, he left. gak! "
    You[ll never get him" they gloated. So, the cops just didn't put it over the radio, and bingo, they got the deadbeat fast. Spending a night in jail didn't set wwell with him. He was bonded out, paid $65 as a start on child support and then disappeared for good which in the end was fine with SIL. She remarried and had a decent job so who needs the creep. I can understand him, but what's with the grandparents. At that time, he said he never wanted to marry again and had no plan for other children, so this was the only grandchild these people would ever have. And they didn't even want to see him.

  14. I agree with dpen. It never ceases to amaze me that adoptees are more likely to relinquish a child. I cannot fathom in my wildest imagination giving my child up for adoption. I could not take the chance of causing my child so much pain. Also, I had already lost my ancestors and could hardly stand to lose my descendants as well. I never really thought about adoption as trying to identify with what my natural mother went through, I thought about it from my perspective as the child.

    I am not saying this to insult any first mothers as I realize you were forced and/or coerced. I grew up in a much freer time and had more options.

    I do think that adoptive grandparents-to-be would feel less of a connection with a grandchild who is not biologically related to them. I remember there was an adopted girl, Lori, on Teen Mom and her APs were adamant that they would not help her one iota to keep her baby. They insisted on the boy being given up for adoption. This was certainly in sharp contrast to all of the other non-adopted girls whose parents were willing to help.

  15. There were several adoptees in the maternity home I stayed in 1986 It struck even then as sad/odd/disturbing that they would be doing what was done to them. It took me years of reading and friendship with them to come close to comprehending. (And I do not proclaim at all to fully understand but these days I do have more empathy and no judgement).

  16. I am one of the adoptees who could not wait to have my own family members. I knew the only way to do it was to create my own. Nothing else mattered to me, not school or career. I met my husband when I was 16 and we had our son when I was 24. We have a wonderful family of 4 children ages 15-26. They saved my life. When I was a girl I used to chant, "family is for other people, but not for me" when I felt bad about being alone. Now family is for me too.

  17. An adoptive mom weighing in here: We have a wide open relationship with our daughter's first parents (they are not together), their extended families, and we are the God Parents of my daughter's two biological siblings. We are a combined family (biological and adoptive) and have been since our daughter was born almost 11 years ago.

    caleigh brooks said...
    "I suppose I better preface this with the premise that infertile couples were groomed by our society to think that if they can't produce their own children, they could just go down to the corner store and pick up a child - so you could say it's not their fault."

    "How is it that we have allowed the media, commerce, and religious nuts, to brainwash our society into thinking that it's perfectly ok for infertile people to take the children that don't belong to them!?"

    As an adoptive parent I can say that I was never "groomed" for adoption or under the impression that I could go down to the corner store and pick up a child. The only knowledge I had was of the cases I had seen in the media, which were horrific. Through a lot of research I realized how I personally wanted to handle the adoption process and what I hoped the relationship with my future child's first family and the child we hoped to one day adopt would be. It wasn't something I just jumped into frivolously.

    You stated that adoptive parents need some reason to believe "it's not their fault". I can only speak of my own experience with adoption and I can tell you that it wasn't my "fault" or anyone else's. It was the decision my daughter's first mother had made and there wasn't much anyone could have done to have changed her mind about. The father supported the adoption as did both families. They had all made that decision and were confident about it long before I came into the picture. That doesn't mean I didn't empathise with everything they went through during that journey or was blind to how heartbreaking that decision truly was for them. But it was nothing like the scenerio we all watched play out on I'm Having Their Baby where the potential adoptive parents were staring at the sonogram screen like ghouls ready to just rip the baby out of the mother's womb.

    As far as "taking children who didn't belong to me". My journey with my daughter's first mom and family(ies) was painful and heartbreaking on a million different levels. However, we didn't kidnap our daughter. I never thought she was somehow pre-destined to be MINE or that she was in anyway owed to me. Nor do I believe that God sent her to me. She is my daughter because her first mother gave her up. She will ALWAYS be her first mother's daughter and she will always be a member of her biological family. Her DNA did not change because she was adopted. Hopefully I am not unique in comprehending that reality!

    I do not believe that all (some? any?) states adoption laws are perfect or even ethical in some cases. Reform is needed. Education is needed. Ensuring that expectant mothers considering adoption are FULLY INFORMED prior to signing relinquishment is absolutely needed. But I do not agree with the assertion that ALL first parents were defrauded of their parents rights, that ALL adoptees are doomed to be scarred and psychologically damaged any more than I believe that ALL adoptive parents are evil-doers with only the worst intentions in mind. I'm not here being "contrite" or "crying crocadile tears" about my own journey. I am here to educate myself for the benefit of my WHOLE family...my daughter, her first parents and their families as well.

  18. I happen to be a member of the forum you quoted from - amom wishing first mom would get pregnant and relinquish again - and it absolutely horrified me! how could you wish someone would go through living hell?!! I just cannot believe how incredibly selfish this is and since its a mixed forum (not just for birth mothers) I didnt feel like I could peacably express my feelings without it coming across as an attack. I absolutely adore our APs and I dont regret picking them as Julians parents - BUT I DO REGRET GIVING HIM AWAY. I would consider WILLINGLY having a child for them (something closer to being a surrogate but without their DNA - intentionally get pregnant for the expressed purpose of giving them a child) but to just find out I was pregnant again and give them the baby no way! I would love for Julian to be a part of a large family (as he already has 4 siblings - 3 bio and 1 adopted) but not when it would cost me my life and well being. As far as him placing a child in the future it would break my heart to know that he suffered the same feelings that me and his father are going through now - that a choice I made (to place him with a family that *might* not accept him totally) would cause him to have to make a choice like that would kill me.

  19. Several years ago, Oprah had guests with a great adoption story. Birth mother finds relinquished daughter. Soon after daughter who is young and single becomes pregnant. Adoptive parents won't help, want daughter to give baby up for adoption. She does--to her birth mother.

  20. Some story, Jane. I wish I'd seen that show. Love to see a follow up.

  21. And 2nd Mom, thanks for your input here. I know that it takes courage to post here but we do like hearing from you, and are pleased to know there are parents like you.

  22. I'm glad Mary finally chose to keep her son.
    But a lot of other people think other wise.


    Check out that link, everyone is making a
    lot of nasty comments about Mary. They are
    calling her "selfish" and are saying she
    "broke the adoptive parents hearts."
    A lot of people in those comments see nothing
    wrong with the PAPs behavior. And they are
    praising Claudia as if she is a saint, for
    giving up her child.

    It scares me that people think behavior like
    that, from PAPs is normal. And think it was
    "abnormal" for Mary to change her mind and
    keep her son.

  23. I don't understand adoptees being more likely to relinquish their babies. I am an adoptee and I became pregnant at age 15. There was NO WAY I was relinquishing my only biological link to another human being. My parents agreed with me and were very supportive. I have found my biological mother, she has since passed away, but I have a sister and 2 brothers on her side and it all worked out for me. I try but I don't understand all the anger about this issue. I never felt anger about any of it.

  24. caleigh brooks said...
    "I suppose I better preface this with the premise that infertile couples were groomed by our society to think that if they can't produce their own children, they could just go down to the corner store and pick up a child - so you could say it's not their fault."

    I'm not an adoptive mom, but I did struggle with infertility before having children....and before we had kids, we got SO MANY comments from people about adoption that made it sounds like it was as simple as going to the corner store. But none of those comments were from other infertile women. They were from fertiles who had no idea about either infertility or adoption. Honestly, every infertile I know got pissed off when people made comments like that.

    But I do know of adoptive moms who talk about how their kids were "meant to be" theirs. I get feeling grateful for your adoptive family, but I don't get the presumption that your child was "meant to be" on the back of someone else's tragedy and loss. That just seems sick.

  25. Anon 10:23 wrote:"but I don't get the presumption that your child was "meant to be" on the back of someone else's tragedy and loss."

    I think that many APs especially from the BSE did not understand or more realistically were not TOLD that they were getting someone else's child based on their tragedy and loss. My APs thought that my first mother simply felt she was too young to raise a child at the time and that she was making the "mature" decision to give me up for adoption. That she and the rest of society really thought it was in my best interest to be raised by a married couple. My APs saw my n-mother as putting me first. My APs were told that my n-mother freely chose to not marry my father and to give me up. When the truth was that she tried desperately to get my n-father to marry her and he refused. My a-father was quite shocked and rather upset when I told him the truth about my first mother never wanting to give me up for adoption and that she was forced because of the social mores of the day.

    There was a post a short while back from Gale Thompson who adopted less than 20 years ago and she also believed that her adopted children needed a home. I still think that the message that APs get to become parents only on the backs of the first mothers tragedy and loss is still not getting through. It would hurt the adoption industry too much. Certainly, there is a lot of stuff out on the internet now and books, etc. but not everyone does the amount of research that they should. I do believe that there are PAPs who would have qualms about acquiring a child on the n-mother's pain and loss.

  26. I just found this blog and it is amazing. I am the child of an adoptee who really has not been able to be a stable person, and sadly, I think because she never felt bonded to anyone, she was not able to be a good mother. I know longer have contact with her. But I will always be grateful that when I became pregnant as a teenager, she urged me to keep my child. She explained how it felt to be adopted and she did not want that for my child.

    I have always been glad that I kept my son. But for years I struggled wondering if HE would have been better off being adopted. I heard all the things you mothers did, he deserves to parents, he deserves more money, my life will be ruined, etc. When my son was about three and we were still so poor I didn't know how I would pay rent and keep the utilities on, I shared my self doubts with another adoptee. She looked at me and said, another family would've given him more stuff, no one but you would've given him more love. That comment changed my life.
    I have known several people in the adoption triad as i believe it's called and I've always wondered why adoption is painted as this rosy thing, yet everyone involved in it seems to have issues.

    Thank you for this blog. I will direct anyone considering placing their child here. Also thank you for always exposing utah for the adoption fraud capital it is. I live in Utah, hopefully not for much longer, and it is a disgrace. LDSFS shames girls into placing with all kinds of threats and promises and a act of love is not much more than a baby broker.

  27. @Anon 6:51pm,

    Your comment makes so much sense to me. That's why I am astounded at Lorraine's 7 times statistic.

  28. Adoption is never necessary.

    Foster care is sometimes necessary.

    Permanent guardianship is sometimes necessary.

    But the changing of a child's birth certificate for the purposes of lying about the child's biological origins? Never necessary.

    When we speak of adoption in this culture we generally mean "someone other than the natural parents raising the child."

    But until we change the practice of falsifying a child's birth certificate, that's not the legal meaning of the term.

    What is needed is serious reform of the foster care system, and some legal definition of permanent guardianship introduced so that children who truly can't go back to their families still have a shot at a good upbringing.

    Adoption is not necessary to accomplish that end.

  29. Most definitely adopters think of their adopted daughters as whores and sluts, the same way they think of their daughters' natural mothers. I grew up hearing this constantly, about both of us, and they would NEVER have supported me in keeping an illegitimate child. They couldn't wait to marry "the slut" off to anyone who would take me so that they could stop worrying about having adopted me. Adoption is all about woman-hatred after all, it's bad enough boys cost more and the girls are what you take when you can't get a boy, but the definite opinion is that we are ALL dirty sluts.

  30. I would love to know the statistic of adoptees are 7x more likely to give a child to adoption than non-adoptees. Do you have a link?

    A great article; thanks.

  31. LauraD:

    I don't recall where I heard or read that statistic and a just spent a few minutes looking for the answer on Google but came up with nothing. It must have been imbedded in some study I read and unfortunately did not keep the reference, or now, remember it. But we have seen and heard of its occurance so often that I think it is likely to be not far from the reality. If I do find it, I will certainly update this post and include it as a source.

    If anyone reading comes upon it, please let us know. Leave it as a comment here and email me at forumfirstmother@gmail.com.


  32. From an early age, my adoptive moth insisted on telling me that if I ever got pregnant before marriage, "That baby is going up for adoption!"
    And the thing is, in my home state one needed their parent's permission for abortion is under 18.
    Needless to say that during my teen year, I practiced a lot of abstinence and was extremely careful. My adoptive mom, lovely woman that she is often accused me of pregnancy even when I was a virgin. It's like she couldn't wait to use me to give back tothe machine.
    Needless to say, I made it to eighteen without a pregnancy. I guess that's one form of birth control, threatening your adopted child by taking away her nonexistent baby.
    My husband and I were pregnant just months after our wedding. I was so excited to finally have a member of my family I would actually be related to and he came out looking just like me. I felt like it was such a gift to me, I still do. But there were a lot of triggers, especially whe he reached the age when I was placed with my adoptive family. He was so small and grumpy at that age. My heart went out...to me.
    I know many adoptive parents who threaten their kids with adoption if they were ever to be pregnant. It think this is a big factor in why many adopters relinquish. I look back on my tween years and the inappropriate things my adoptive mother say to me and I cringe.



    If you can keep your baby then do, however the world is not a idealistic place, and stories constrict that all baits should stay with bode relatives, as simply , blood relatives gives not guarantee, that does not men at all it all always work... but great if all unwanted and unplanned babies are taken ion by extended families who may be willing to take on other responsibility.

    a) gives a Home b) Gives Hope, c) gives Love, c) Shelter, warmth... and most of all gives a baby / child a family.

    Interesting Blogs, but some of the blogs are like so negative to adoption? sad they don't or have not seen any happy successful adoptions, but guess in the beginning its the babies that where not successful ,and their bios through whatever reason gave them up... and contrary to the belief that kids are kidnapped, or babies are taken against a bios will, the bios cannot take care lf them full stop. geeps...

    so what does one just do? neglect babies and kids to a system for ever in limbo,leave them on streets to fend for themselves? who through no fault of their own are with out parents?

    And sorry....Having a baby does not make you a parent, only make you have the ability to get pregnant.

    Stats in some places are so high its unbelievable , but true and facts, is that so many children in this world are and were simply unplanned and not wanted , full stop... as abortion clear is a result of that.

    As long as there are some bios or don't give a dam, their always will be a place for Adoption. ( I am not at all talking about any loving and caring parent (regardless if bio or adoptive). Parents are the one who are their 24/7 stay up when you are sick and need love and Comfort, who take you to school, who dress and fee their children, wether adopted or not, parents are the ones who step up to the hard times as well as enjoy the good.

    I certainly takes a lot of courage to give something up you can honestly say you cannot take care of... and courage to accept a baby or child not blood related that takes unconditional accepting Love.

    it takes no courage to neglect and abandon a baby or child. And to not give a baby or child a fresh start, or any hope regardless if adoptive would be selfish not to allow for any baby/ child.

    however while there are abusive birth parents and young kids/ teenagers who use sex as a recreational tool to then only become pregnant to a baby they have no idea how to keep or pay for, there will always be the Need for Adoption.

    There are children stuck in systems all because of lack of and no care what so ever form their bio parents.

    Just because a child has blood relatives doe snot automatically make Bio parents trusted embers of society who are responsible to care for babies or young children.

    Most/ all Adoptive parents "are screened very well", and most have to have gone through a gruelling and strict system to PROVE they are of good character and FIT to be parents.... what prove do bios have to prove to a vulnerable dependant baby?.

    Just Open your home and place your words in action to help, stoop criticising adoption... as to often it only comes form negative and unhelpful people who don't lift a hand to help...



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